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highme
(@highme)
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18/04/2019 12:15 am  

And my Tactical ADVs are still a great pair of boots. The sole reduction on them is bonkers. I'm now able to consider riding a bunch of boards (mostly Burton) that I'd skipped over because 255mm was the narrowest I could really fuck with.


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awd1105
(@awd1105)
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18/04/2019 4:05 am  

I haven't paid full retail for any snowboard-related item in at least twelve years.

Unrelated to boots however, the closest I've ever come was getting 10% off a Korua at the beginning of this season. In hindsight, I love that thing so much I wouldn't have minded paying full pop for it.  

Ontario | Boots: Driver X | Bindings: modified Genesis X | Boards: CaféRacer & CaféRacer+ 159 / Cheetah 159 / LandLord 163 / Deep Thinker 160


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Mig
 Mig
(@migfullbag)
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18/04/2019 10:15 am  
Posted by: matty

All of this boils down to the fact that boots are both the single most important piece of snowboarding gear and also the one that still needs the most improvement. Boards, bindings, outerwear, goggles, etc. are available from multiple brands that cover just about every reasonable pricepoint and use scenario. Boots seem to fit very few people well, and also appear to have a much higher failure rate than any other piece of gear. Beyond cosmetics, the segment leaders (Burton, Salmon, K2, Ride, Adidas, thirtytwo, DC) have made only small improvements in the last 10+ years to boots. Many of us are in boots with $400+ retail prices that we have to replace every two or three seasons. That sucks.

The fault is part on us, as snowboarders, and part on the segment leaders. Most snowboarders are more concerned about looks then performance and duralibilty, and the main companies are taking advantage of it (no durability = more yearly sales). To increase performance and durability, more obvious plastic components would have to be integrated in the boots. Most "core" snowboarders are so fucking obsessed and afraid to look like "skiers" that the acceptance of anything that would really be an improvement is almost impossible.

~6' or 182cm | way too fat | US 10.5 - Mondo 28.5
Quiver: Fullbag boards 154 to 181 cm | powder/carving/snowsurf
Boots: Burton Driver X with Scarpa Plus Fit High Liners and custom powerstrap
Bindings: Ride El Hefe | Now Drive


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Hai
 Hai
(@redlude97)
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18/04/2019 10:39 am  
Posted by: Mig
Posted by: matty

All of this boils down to the fact that boots are both the single most important piece of snowboarding gear and also the one that still needs the most improvement. Boards, bindings, outerwear, goggles, etc. are available from multiple brands that cover just about every reasonable pricepoint and use scenario. Boots seem to fit very few people well, and also appear to have a much higher failure rate than any other piece of gear. Beyond cosmetics, the segment leaders (Burton, Salmon, K2, Ride, Adidas, thirtytwo, DC) have made only small improvements in the last 10+ years to boots. Many of us are in boots with $400+ retail prices that we have to replace every two or three seasons. That sucks.

The fault is part on us, as snowboarders, and part on the segment leaders. Most snowboarders are more concerned about looks then performance and duralibilty, and the main companies are taking advantage of it (no durability = more yearly sales). To increase performance and durability, more obvious plastic components would have to be integrated in the boots. Most "core" snowboarders are so fucking obsessed and afraid to look like "skiers" that the acceptance of anything that would really be an improvement is almost impossible.

See the splitboard thread for evidence  👍 


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MarkusM
(@markusm)
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18/04/2019 11:03 pm  

the boot that has held up the best has been 32 lashed xlt but they had a wonky fit for me.

0ver 150 days on them and the shell looks like new.

 


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89c51
(@89c51)
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19/04/2019 2:28 am  
Posted by: Mig
Posted by: matty

All of this boils down to the fact that boots are both the single most important piece of snowboarding gear and also the one that still needs the most improvement. Boards, bindings, outerwear, goggles, etc. are available from multiple brands that cover just about every reasonable pricepoint and use scenario. Boots seem to fit very few people well, and also appear to have a much higher failure rate than any other piece of gear. Beyond cosmetics, the segment leaders (Burton, Salmon, K2, Ride, Adidas, thirtytwo, DC) have made only small improvements in the last 10+ years to boots. Many of us are in boots with $400+ retail prices that we have to replace every two or three seasons. That sucks.

The fault is part on us, as snowboarders, and part on the segment leaders. Most snowboarders are more concerned about looks then performance and duralibilty, and the main companies are taking advantage of it (no durability = more yearly sales). To increase performance and durability, more obvious plastic components would have to be integrated in the boots. Most "core" snowboarders are so fucking obsessed and afraid to look like "skiers" that the acceptance of anything that would really be an improvement is almost impossible.

Are we sure that tech wise (materials) we can create boots that are comfortable and durable/long lasting at the same time and at a reasonable cost??

Because B tried that with some Ions in the past that promised that (more or less) and those stuff were the worst crap i ever slipped my feet in.


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tierarzt
(@tierarzt)
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19/04/2019 2:40 am  
Posted by: 89c51
Posted by: Mig
Posted by: matty

All of this boils down to the fact that boots are both the single most important piece of snowboarding gear and also the one that still needs the most improvement. Boards, bindings, outerwear, goggles, etc. are available from multiple brands that cover just about every reasonable pricepoint and use scenario. Boots seem to fit very few people well, and also appear to have a much higher failure rate than any other piece of gear. Beyond cosmetics, the segment leaders (Burton, Salmon, K2, Ride, Adidas, thirtytwo, DC) have made only small improvements in the last 10+ years to boots. Many of us are in boots with $400+ retail prices that we have to replace every two or three seasons. That sucks.

The fault is part on us, as snowboarders, and part on the segment leaders. Most snowboarders are more concerned about looks then performance and duralibilty, and the main companies are taking advantage of it (no durability = more yearly sales). To increase performance and durability, more obvious plastic components would have to be integrated in the boots. Most "core" snowboarders are so fucking obsessed and afraid to look like "skiers" that the acceptance of anything that would really be an improvement is almost impossible.

Are we sure that tech wise (materials) we can create boots that are comfortable and durable/long lasting at the same time and at a reasonable cost??

Because B tried that with some Ions in the past that promised that (more or less) and those stuff were the worst crap i ever slipped my feet in.

Ideally I want an over-built boot that is stiff-as-hell out of the box, and retains that stiffness for as long as possible. I'm not interested in a boot that breaks-in easily and quickly if it then mushes-out quickly too. I couldn't care less what it looks like as long as it comes in black. 

 


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Elektropow
(@elektropow)
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19/04/2019 2:58 am  
Posted by: 89c51
Posted by: Mig
Posted by: matty

All of this boils down to the fact that boots are both the single most important piece of snowboarding gear and also the one that still needs the most improvement. Boards, bindings, outerwear, goggles, etc. are available from multiple brands that cover just about every reasonable pricepoint and use scenario. Boots seem to fit very few people well, and also appear to have a much higher failure rate than any other piece of gear. Beyond cosmetics, the segment leaders (Burton, Salmon, K2, Ride, Adidas, thirtytwo, DC) have made only small improvements in the last 10+ years to boots. Many of us are in boots with $400+ retail prices that we have to replace every two or three seasons. That sucks.

The fault is part on us, as snowboarders, and part on the segment leaders. Most snowboarders are more concerned about looks then performance and duralibilty, and the main companies are taking advantage of it (no durability = more yearly sales). To increase performance and durability, more obvious plastic components would have to be integrated in the boots. Most "core" snowboarders are so fucking obsessed and afraid to look like "skiers" that the acceptance of anything that would really be an improvement is almost impossible.

Are we sure that tech wise (materials) we can create boots that are comfortable and durable/long lasting at the same time and at a reasonable cost??

Because B tried that with some Ions in the past that promised that (more or less) and those stuff were the worst crap i ever slipped my feet in.

The ions with the infinite ride liners (15 16?) Are dope, but yeah, the liners don't really break in. A lot of people had fit issues. To me they're perfect apart from a little heel hold tampering on my second pair with a bootfitter and the outer shell material seems bomb proof. Closest to great fit that lasts and lasts. My first pair still has some life left, second pair for this season is starting to collapse a bit on left boots medial side near the arch, but that still doesn't create pressure issues as I think the liner helps mitigate that.

If you could get similar liners with custom fitting, that would be pretty close.


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Hai
 Hai
(@redlude97)
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19/04/2019 7:49 am  

If you want the burliest boot out there

fitwell backcountry color black white f25


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c.fuzzy
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Posts: 1248
19/04/2019 9:51 am  

Most of the recent BC boots I've fondled seem pretty burl and like they could last multiple seasons. The 32 JJ and the Vans Verse as well. 

I wouldn't mind trying one of em. 

donuts


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matty
(@matty)
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19/04/2019 10:50 am  
Posted by: Hai
Posted by: Mig
Posted by: matty

All of this boils down to the fact that boots are both the single most important piece of snowboarding gear and also the one that still needs the most improvement. Boards, bindings, outerwear, goggles, etc. are available from multiple brands that cover just about every reasonable pricepoint and use scenario. Boots seem to fit very few people well, and also appear to have a much higher failure rate than any other piece of gear. Beyond cosmetics, the segment leaders (Burton, Salmon, K2, Ride, Adidas, thirtytwo, DC) have made only small improvements in the last 10+ years to boots. Many of us are in boots with $400+ retail prices that we have to replace every two or three seasons. That sucks.

The fault is part on us, as snowboarders, and part on the segment leaders. Most snowboarders are more concerned about looks then performance and duralibilty, and the main companies are taking advantage of it (no durability = more yearly sales). To increase performance and durability, more obvious plastic components would have to be integrated in the boots. Most "core" snowboarders are so fucking obsessed and afraid to look like "skiers" that the acceptance of anything that would really be an improvement is almost impossible.

See the splitboard thread for evidence  👍 

Not sure I agree. The splitboard thread involves some skepticism about whether or not hard shell boots purpose-built for skiing (and which are apparently most functional for the touring aspect of both splitboarding and ski touring) can be as functional for snowboarding as currently-available dedicated soft shell snowboard boots are.

As for whether or not snowboarders' claimed aesthetic preferences against exposed plastic on boots is the root cause for the lack of progress in snowboard boots over the last-ish decade, I'm not sure that I agree with that, either. Ski boots are designed for skiing. As such, they are designed to flex toe-heel but are designed purposely to minimize flex medially-laterally. That is not optimum for most snowboarding, where controlled flex at the ankle is needed in all potential directions. [Also of note is Burton's current line-up of boots (probably the most popular boot brand on the market), which features exposed plastic shells on the toes of the Ion, Ion Boa, Toursit, Tourist X, and Driver X.]


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89c51
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19/04/2019 11:41 am  
Posted by: Elektropow
Posted by: 89c51

 

Are we sure that tech wise (materials) we can create boots that are comfortable and durable/long lasting at the same time and at a reasonable cost??

Because B tried that with some Ions in the past that promised that (more or less) and those stuff were the worst crap i ever slipped my feet in.

The ions with the infinite ride liners (15 16?) Are dope, but yeah, the liners don't really break in. A lot of people had fit issues. To me they're perfect apart from a little heel hold tampering on my second pair with a bootfitter and the outer shell material seems bomb proof. Closest to great fit that lasts and lasts. My first pair still has some life left, second pair for this season is starting to collapse a bit on left boots medial side near the arch, but that still doesn't create pressure issues as I think the liner helps mitigate that.

If you could get similar liners with custom fitting, that would be pretty close.

Those things were AIDS. There hasn't been another piece of snowboard equipment that i had the urge to set on fire.


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MarkusM
(@markusm)
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19/04/2019 12:15 pm  

im with 89 on that.

and speaking of the outer shell material it started to break after about 40ish days. 

 

This post was modified 1 month ago by MarkusM

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Elektropow
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19/04/2019 12:40 pm  

Interesting. 

Soooo comfy, mmm.


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Spenser
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19/04/2019 2:03 pm  

Yeah, I can’t think of a more polarizing boot than those with infinite ride liners. To me, it changed my whole game for the better. They fit pretty great out of the box, then quickly mold to my feet just a little bit, and then stay there forever. I love both pairs of my ions.

The only thing I don’t like is the top Velcro closure. It is misaligned for me, in the same way on all 4 pairs. Not a big deal, just kind of weird

This post was modified 1 month ago by Spenser

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