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Velvet Hammer
(@velvethammer)
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09/10/2019 7:22 am  

@matty

If you like stiff boots tryout the Thirtytwo TM2 XLT. To me they are crazy stiff.


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(@notmikebuckley)
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09/10/2019 8:10 am  

tactical boost update:  they sent me a 9 instead of a 9.5, I can fit into it with very minimal toe cramping..but I'm not sure these will pack out enough. 

skier


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(@notmikebuckley)
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09/10/2019 8:30 am  

If someone wants them I'd do $150 and split shipping on them.

skier


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Lonz
 Lonz
(@alonzo)
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09/10/2019 9:40 am  
Posted by: @pow_hnd
Posted by: @elektropow
Posted by: @bopuc
Posted by: @elektropow
Posted by: @matty

Am wanting to move on from my current boots. They are the 2018 Burton SLX with about 70 days on them. While they're fine to get me started this season, the liners are starting to fall apart and I'm sick of snapping speed laces. I've also come to the conclusion that the SLX is just a little softer than what I want - especially after putting 70ish days on them. One positive is that they don't seem to have packed out much, and the shells are holding up well (which is especially nice in light of the ones I have being a warranty RMA replacement for a pair of 2017 SLX that had the speed lace tunnels start to rip out of the shells after about a year and 40-50 days of riding).

Looking at what's out there, the Vans Verse has caught my interest. I haven't been able to try those on yet, but I did try on the Mens Aura Pro yesterday to check and see if Vans uses a last that fits my feet. First impressions were good. It seemed like a medium volume fit with a decently narrow heel pocket and well-established j-bar shaping in the liner. Minimal heel lift and they fit true to size on my feet (I tried them on in a 13, which is what I generally wear in snowboard boots). My only reservation was that the liners felt a little cushy - like they would be prone to a significant packing out. Can any Vans riders comment on pack-out?

I'll try to get my feet in some Verses to see if they similarly have a good fit for me. If they don't, maybe I'll try Salomons again or some Nitros?

My verses have been the most agressively packed out boot. Couple days i already got a lot of extra room, which sucked. Shop demo similar to your experience.

Nitros are good and don't pack out as aggressively. Bit on the narrow side.

Would like to try tridents. The insanos felt super good and it's crazy how you can alleviate that stiffness with just the upper boa without sacrificing hold. Did not think that'd be possible with such a hard material. 

Also rocked the verses the few days I got to with the top boa as loose as possible (open, lean forward and move around, lock or leave unlocked) and they were still stiffer than my broken in ions.

My Verses turned out to be way too narrow for my feet and caused me a bunion (which will eventually require surgery). If you have wide feet, keep that in mind. Mine did not pack out in the ~20 days I used em (late last season, a lot of backcountry splitting). They are stiff as all heck (I like that but it ain't for everyone).

Burton Ions are a bit stiffer than SLX.

I wanted to give Deeluxe a shot but when I tried 'em on they were ridiculously loose on the upper part. Couldn't get them snug no matter how hard I tried. Store guy said "that's Deeluxe. that's how they make em…" 🤷‍♂️

Lots of people here seem to love Adidas ATV Tacticals. Worth a try.

Interesting. My feet are "normal" width to the millimeter, according to a measuring scale at a shop. So in my experience the us8.5 verse at least is slightly wider than normal after initial quite drastic break in. Burton infinite ride liner is perfect in all measurements as are higher end nitro boots, which come super close to the IRL in fit. People who like the IRL fit seem to be in the minority though. Ride fit was close at a shop, but no experience in break in. 

Rides don't really break in much. The liners adjust to your feet a bit, but they don't really pack and  their off the shelf flex pretty much stays the same for the life of the boot because of their "slime" tongue.. I've been on Tridents for 3 years and the flex is still almost the same as the day I bought them. 

This has been my experience as well.  I just bought a new pair for this season, but my existing pair are still as stiff as ever.  I'll just rock two pairs now: my old pair will get my Intuition SBC wraps and will only be used for morning groomers on my metal board, and the new ones will be for everything else.   


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matty
(@matty)
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09/10/2019 11:47 am  

DC, ThirtyTwo, Adidas, K2, Deeluxe, and Ride have not previously fit my feet very well when I have tried them on. I have a pair of TM-2s from 2015 or '16 that are the worst-fitting boots that I've ever owned. The heel pocket in those is so high-volume and resulted in so much heel lift that I felt like I went up on tiptoe when I did toe-side turns. Even after extensive  liner modifications and adding a shim under my insoles, I probably still get about .75" of heel lift.

I have narrow feet with relatively high arches and especially sharp and narrow heels. On a brannock, I am a size 14 with an A or narrower width. I prefer a very tight fit, including length. So far, Nike and Burton in a size 13 and with a decent amount of liner modification and SuperFeet insoles have fit me best - specifically the ZoomITES, LunarEndor, Ion, and SLX. Salomon's old F-series boots were okay, but not great. Trying on the Malamute and a couple of other Salomon models in recent years, they still seem to only fit me okay, with a little too much width overall and a heel pocket that doesn't really lock me in. DCs and thirtytwos are too wide and generally high volume. K2s fit my feet a little narrower than DCs or thirtytwos, but still not great. Adidas is way too wide in the forefoot. Deeluxe fit me like shit. Highest-volume boots I've ever tried on. Ride are okay in the heel, but do not fit my foot true-to-length. I would likely need them in a size 14, as every Ride boot that I have tried in 13 was too short for my foot.

With Nike no longer making boots, I switched back to Burton three seasons ago after initially trying thirtytwo. I'm kind of done with Burton's boot prices and speedzone lacing. The top-of-the-line LIFE+ liners in my SLX are starting to fall apart on the insides of my heels, and as a result I got hot spots and blisters at Hood this Summer. I haven't had to deal with blisters from snowboard boots in YEARS. I was able to tear some liner material out that seemed to be folding over on itself and leading to the blister-causing pressure points (exact same issue in both boots), so hopefully this won't still be a problem if I'm in the SLX to start the season. Still, I am ready to move on.

I want to try something new. I prefer a mid-stiff boot, and of all the boots that I've had, the ZoomITES after initial break-in and with a mix of the medium and stiff inserts have been the closest to my ideal. I am hoping that I might be able to get something similar with the Verse, and I also want to try a boa boot. I'll pat attention to the fit when I try them on in my size, and if pack-out looks like a potential problem or there are any fit issues that seem like I won't be able to fix, then I'll probably go to Nitro as my next choice. Not sure of the model.


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pow_hnd
(@pow_hnd)
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Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 434
09/10/2019 12:23 pm  
Posted by: @matty

DC, ThirtyTwo, Adidas, K2, Deeluxe, and Ride have not previously fit my feet very well when I have tried them on. I have a pair of TM-2s from 2015 or '16 that are the worst-fitting boots that I've ever owned. The heel pocket in those is so high-volume and resulted in so much heel lift that I felt like I went up on tiptoe when I did toe-side turns. Even after extensive  liner modifications and adding a shim under my insoles, I probably still get about .75" of heel lift.

I have narrow feet with relatively high arches and especially sharp and narrow heels. On a brannock, I am a size 14 with an A or narrower width. I prefer a very tight fit, including length. So far, Nike and Burton in a size 13 and with a decent amount of liner modification and SuperFeet insoles have fit me best - specifically the ZoomITES, LunarEndor, Ion, and SLX. Salomon's old F-series boots were okay, but not great. Trying on the Malamute and a couple of other Salomon models in recent years, they still seem to only fit me okay, with a little too much width overall and a heel pocket that doesn't really lock me in. DCs and thirtytwos are too wide and generally high volume. K2s fit my feet a little narrower than DCs or thirtytwos, but still not great. Adidas is way too wide in the forefoot. Deeluxe fit me like shit. Highest-volume boots I've ever tried on. Ride are okay in the heel, but do not fit my foot true-to-length. I would likely need them in a size 14, as every Ride boot that I have tried in 13 was too short for my foot.

With Nike no longer making boots, I switched back to Burton three seasons ago after initially trying thirtytwo. I'm kind of done with Burton's boot prices and speedzone lacing. The top-of-the-line LIFE+ liners in my SLX are starting to fall apart on the insides of my heels, and as a result I got hot spots and blisters at Hood this Summer. I haven't had to deal with blisters from snowboard boots in YEARS. I was able to tear some liner material out that seemed to be folding over on itself and leading to the blister-causing pressure points (exact same issue in both boots), so hopefully this won't still be a problem if I'm in the SLX to start the season. Still, I am ready to move on.

I want to try something new. I prefer a mid-stiff boot, and of all the boots that I've had, the ZoomITES after initial break-in and with a mix of the medium and stiff inserts have been the closest to my ideal. I am hoping that I might be able to get something similar with the Verse, and I also want to try a boa boot. I'll pat attention to the fit when I try them on in my size, and if pack-out looks like a potential problem or there are any fit issues that seem like I won't be able to fix, then I'll probably go to Nitro as my next choice. Not sure of the model.

Interesting, I have an A width foot as well, and Ride boots fit the best off the shelf than any other boot out there, but I still did a ton of liner mods. 

With that being said, DC boots seem to work the best for me, and I have gone back to them this year, I just got a new pair of T-Rices. I will have to mod the liner a bunch, but there has never been boots that I haven't had to do that on. I find the DC liners to be the most comfy, then I go from there to make them fit. If I were to do Burtons it would have to be SLX, but I can't justify $600 when I'm gonna still need to get a custom footbed and mod the hell out of the liners. Plus, I just don't trust Speed Zone lacing, no matter what brand and their variation of it, it always loosens. Dual BOA for me is the jam, tighten them up for my first run, then after my first run give them a flex and one more adjustment and I'm set for the day. Also what I love about DC boots with dual BOA is for splitting I can tighten the liner harness and lower BOA up nice and tight, but run the upper BOA loose on the up, which gives me a nicer stride, but the lower BOA and ankle harness keep my foot from moving and getting blisters. That was a major problem with my Ride Tridents, with no liner harness or laces since it was a power wrap. I had to keep both BOAs tight on the way up, which I hated. 

YMMV, but it sounds like you're in the same boat as me, that there will never be an off the shelf well fitting boot.

So I go get custom footbeds, and then use a bunch of boot fitting foam to make everything just right....

Have you ever done a break pad on your liner/shell tongue?  Makes a WORLD of difference. 

You can see these pics here where I have a break pad and then a bunch of foam to stop heel lift and take up volume to stop foot roll and my foot from arching...

IMG 0148
IMG 0147
IMG 1142
IMG 1145
IMG 1144
IMG 1143


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Elektropow
(@elektropow)
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Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 649
09/10/2019 1:51 pm  
Posted by: @matty

DC, ThirtyTwo, Adidas, K2, Deeluxe, and Ride have not previously fit my feet very well when I have tried them on. I have a pair of TM-2s from 2015 or '16 that are the worst-fitting boots that I've ever owned. The heel pocket in those is so high-volume and resulted in so much heel lift that I felt like I went up on tiptoe when I did toe-side turns. Even after extensive  liner modifications and adding a shim under my insoles, I probably still get about .75" of heel lift.

I have narrow feet with relatively high arches and especially sharp and narrow heels. On a brannock, I am a size 14 with an A or narrower width. I prefer a very tight fit, including length. So far, Nike and Burton in a size 13 and with a decent amount of liner modification and SuperFeet insoles have fit me best - specifically the ZoomITES, LunarEndor, Ion, and SLX. Salomon's old F-series boots were okay, but not great. Trying on the Malamute and a couple of other Salomon models in recent years, they still seem to only fit me okay, with a little too much width overall and a heel pocket that doesn't really lock me in. DCs and thirtytwos are too wide and generally high volume. K2s fit my feet a little narrower than DCs or thirtytwos, but still not great. Adidas is way too wide in the forefoot. Deeluxe fit me like shit. Highest-volume boots I've ever tried on. Ride are okay in the heel, but do not fit my foot true-to-length. I would likely need them in a size 14, as every Ride boot that I have tried in 13 was too short for my foot.

With Nike no longer making boots, I switched back to Burton three seasons ago after initially trying thirtytwo. I'm kind of done with Burton's boot prices and speedzone lacing. The top-of-the-line LIFE+ liners in my SLX are starting to fall apart on the insides of my heels, and as a result I got hot spots and blisters at Hood this Summer. I haven't had to deal with blisters from snowboard boots in YEARS. I was able to tear some liner material out that seemed to be folding over on itself and leading to the blister-causing pressure points (exact same issue in both boots), so hopefully this won't still be a problem if I'm in the SLX to start the season. Still, I am ready to move on.

I want to try something new. I prefer a mid-stiff boot, and of all the boots that I've had, the ZoomITES after initial break-in and with a mix of the medium and stiff inserts have been the closest to my ideal. I am hoping that I might be able to get something similar with the Verse, and I also want to try a boa boot. I'll pat attention to the fit when I try them on in my size, and if pack-out looks like a potential problem or there are any fit issues that seem like I won't be able to fix, then I'll probably go to Nitro as my next choice. Not sure of the model.

If you have a slightly narrower foot for size, Nitro might work for you. Not a ton extra space upwards either. The ankle articulation is good, but not super grabby like an Adidas. Feel locked in similar to newer Vans. Had to get rid of the plastic heel huggers as they gave me pressure issues, having a bit higher instep. My heels felt locked in with only the boot holding my feet in as I got rid of the rope surrounding the liner as well (Capitals)

The Team and El Mejor are slightly softer than Ions. The Capitals are gnar stiff (stiffer than Driver X even without either of the inserts). If you like a supportive feel with a bit of flex, close to an Ion, I'd look at the Select. If a bit less, the Team or El Mejor (near identical flex and fit wise). Quality boots regardless and the footprint is similar to Ions and even smaller on some models. They get shit for their speed lacing system, but I never had any problems apart from being slightly slower than Burtons. They also stay locked in the whole day, but you gotta know how to engage the lock. 


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matty
(@matty)
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Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 1472
09/10/2019 1:52 pm  
Posted by: @pow_hnd
Posted by: @matty

yada yada...

Interesting, I have an A width foot as well, and Ride boots fit the best off the shelf than any other boot out there, but I still did a ton of liner mods. 

With that being said, DC boots seem to work the best for me, and I have gone back to them this year, I just got a new pair of T-Rices. I will have to mod the liner a bunch, but there has never been boots that I haven't had to do that on. I find the DC liners to be the most comfy, then I go from there to make them fit. If I were to do Burtons it would have to be SLX, but I can't justify $600 when I'm gonna still need to get a custom footbed and mod the hell out of the liners. Plus, I just don't trust Speed Zone lacing, no matter what brand and their variation of it, it always loosens. Dual BOA for me is the jam, tighten them up for my first run, then after my first run give them a flex and one more adjustment and I'm set for the day. Also what I love about DC boots with dual BOA is for splitting I can tighten the liner harness and lower BOA up nice and tight, but run the upper BOA loose on the up, which gives me a nicer stride, but the lower BOA and ankle harness keep my foot from moving and getting blisters. That was a major problem with my Ride Tridents, with no liner harness or laces since it was a power wrap. I had to keep both BOAs tight on the way up, which I hated. 

YMMV, but it sounds like you're in the same boat as me, that there will never be an off the shelf well fitting boot.

So I go get custom footbeds, and then use a bunch of boot fitting foam to make everything just right....

Have you ever done a break pad on your liner/shell tongue?  Makes a WORLD of difference. 

You can see these pics here where I have a break pad and then a bunch of foam to stop heel lift and take up volume to stop foot roll and my foot from arching...

IMG 0148
IMG 0147
IMG 1142
IMG 1145
IMG 1144
IMG 1143

I have done a break pad, but it didn't do much for me. While I have a narrow foot, I actually still have an overall mid-volume foot due to a high arch and instep. My ankles aren't particularly narrow, and my lower calves are medium/high volume due to being strong like bull from a life of soccer, hockey, skate, and snow. I do use a shit ton of liner mod foam. Similar to you, I do narrowing pads and a heel butterfly/extra j bar combo. It helps a bunch. My SLXs have fit me pretty well with the modded liners, and I would be willing to deal with the speedzone lacing for a while longer if the liners weren't falling apart and causing blisters. I have almost no heel lift (though apparently still enough movement in the heel to cause blisters when combined with the new pressure points from the failing liners). Agreed on Burton's boot pricing. I didn't pay the $600 retail price for my SLXs, and I absolutely wouldn't.

I have had custom footbeds in the past, though not for snowboard boots. I am fortunate in that stock green and blue Superfeet actually fit my foot really well. I will stick with those.

I may have to revisit DCs. If they work for your narrow feet, they may work for mine, too. The T. Rice seems like the best option for what I am looking for.

My main fit issue with Ride is length rather than width. On my foot, their size 13 (largest size in most of their models) has traditionally fit more like a 12. My toes get JAMMED up against the inside of the toe box, even after lacing the boots tight and bending my knees to get my heels to seat in the heel pocket. I'll check them again, but the last time I tried them was within the last two seasons


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Elektropow
(@elektropow)
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Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 649
09/10/2019 1:57 pm  

DC's @us8-8.5 felt super roomy for my mid wide feet, apart from the ankle.. Think I tried the judges and some other model I can't remember. Last season's models.


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matty
(@matty)
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Posts: 1472
09/10/2019 5:08 pm  
Posted by: @elektropow

DC's @us8-8.5 felt super roomy for my mid wide feet, apart from the ankle.. Think I tried the judges and some other model I can't remember. Last season's models.

That's more in-line with what I have experienced when I tried them on.


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