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Spenser
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16/02/2020 5:01 pm  

I do really need to try a Korua. May try to procure one for next year… not sure which one, though. Pencil is probably most attractive to me. Also always liked the CR. I’m not quite into the fat waists though.. 260 is good for me.

Rode the fusion the last 2 days, after the squash. So, I dig it, it’s very fun. Extra setback is the way to go. Love the extra stiffness, and switch is fun. It’s really smooth and feels damp... I’ve heard playmaker factory tends to turn out more beefy feeling boards? If so, this is one. Nice and stout, nose is strong and doesn’t fold at all, etc. Burly rather than lively; my style. Only thing I wish is that it were true camber. Conditions have been the same and I'm just not getting quite the same bite for carving, despite solid flex & I like the sidecut temperament. That said, so fun jumping around pow leftovers, sidehits, etc. Bringing back some freestyle vibes since I can comfortably go backward, hah. Going to be sweet in spring when it’s sunny & slushy.


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Elektropow
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17/02/2020 12:13 am  

I feel Playmaker has a broad spectrum and doesn't really have that proprietary feel. I would call my Überspoon, the new Santoku or say something like the Amplid Stereo anything but beefy. More like lively high tech rippers and super light weight. But when they're requested a charger, they deliver. As we've talked about in the Amplid thread, UNW8 and Pentaquark are good examples as are the Nitro Banker, OG Squash, Fusion etc. 

@michi you're right, this year's Fusion feels like a noodle in comparison to the red crimson one hand flexing.. Is this becoming a trend for Nitro? Anyone who wants a stiff Banker, don't wait for the pretty colored one for next season! Ha.


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Spenser
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20/02/2020 12:31 am  

I think that thought came from someone’s comment on a brand that had switched from playmaker to the mothership, where they’d noticed the difference I mentioned. Disregard..

I wonder, why the difference? The first-gens are so good. Graphics too 😬


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GD
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20/02/2020 10:09 am  
Posted by: @spenser

I think that thought came from someone’s comment on a brand that had switched from playmaker to the mothership, where they’d noticed the difference I mentioned.

Yeah, think it was the Amplid thread, but moved from Mothership to Playmaker iirc? And loll @elektropow, I'm getting that Banker next year to round off my trio 😅.

Sidenote on Amplid: after almost 10 days on it now, I'm really loving the Penta a ton. Mothership-build plus the Antiphase; one of the best feeling rides ever felt, personally. Great balance of energy/liveliness and good stability at speed. A part of me questions whether I should've gotten a backup from their outlet sale, with the Penta made a little differently now.

But ya, awesome board and build quality. Don't feel like riding anything else right now tbh lol.

This post was modified 4 days ago by GD

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parker
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21/02/2020 7:40 am  

So I rode the banker the day after I rode the kill switch hand flexing the amplid kill switch felt much softer but under foot the flex felt about the same they also rode very similar except the kill switch has much more ww. So strange. I also hand flexed a current season 159 squash at a shop in jackson and a 159 fusion next to it. The flex on the squash felt stiffer behind the nose through the tail the nose felt softer  but the fusion did feel much less stiff than the one I have which someone already pointed out. I may be tempted to find a current season 163 on sale now since it feels stiffer than last years. I'm trading a 2nd banker I acquired for my old preproduction OG squash. So i get that and can hand flex it i'll have a much better idea of the new compared to the OG since I haven't flexed an OG in a while. 


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GD
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21/02/2020 8:17 am  
Posted by: @parker

So I rode the banker the day after I rode the kill switch hand flexing the amplid kill switch felt much softer but under foot the flex felt about the same they also rode very similar except the kill switch has much more ww. So strange.

Was this next year's Banker? If so, what did you think of it relative to this year's? Flex range underfoot still around an "8"?


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nmb
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21/02/2020 8:51 am  

wait so first year fusion is stiffer than the second year?


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pow_hnd
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21/02/2020 10:03 am  
Posted by: @elektropow

 

@michi you're right, this year's Fusion feels like a noodle in comparison to the red crimson one hand flexing.. Is this becoming a trend for Nitro? 

I can't say if it becoming a trend for Nitro, but this is what I can tell you from almost 2 decades in the industry and being  tech rep and R&D rider for a major brand. 

Yes, most likely it is becoming a trend for Nitro. 

But it happens with all brands as they grow.

Ever ridden a first or second year Capita Black Snowboard of Death? Those things were crazy stiff. Are they that stiff anymore? Nope. Not even close.

Wanna know the reason?

Sales growth.

As a brand and/or board becomes more popular ( with very few exceptions ) a brands boards generally get softer. Why? Because Joe Schmoe, your average weekend warrior who only rides 7.1 days a year according to the National Ski Area Association, wants to go buy that high end board that he/she saw in a video or saw a pro rider riding. The issue is the MFG wants them to have a good time on that deck, so as it ( the deck or brand ) becomes more popular, they soften up the decks so your 7.1 day a year rider will have a good time on it. If it's super stiff, your less skilled riders will more than likely not have a good time with the brand/board and might go else where on their next purchase. 

It why Burtons are all general pretty soft. They want to make sure they keep that top market share. Yes, they have a range of stiffness in their brand relative to their other decks, but they don't make anything truly stiff ( at least in my opinion ) and they won't because they want Joe Schmoe to keep coming back and buying that $600 Custom every other year, or maybe every year. With the exception of one or two decks in the Burton line, your Joe Schmoe can buy any one of Burtons decks and be able to ride it and have a good time. If they make it stiff and the rider that only rides 7.1 days a year struggles with it because it's more board than they can handle, they may lose future sales. 

You have to remember, we here on EL are the small minority. The vast majority of purchase power in the industry comes from weekend warriors, and brands want them, with their lesser skills to have fun on that "high-end" deck they just purchased. 

So, generally, when a boards sales unit numbers move up, the deck softens, or has something else done to make it easier to ride by the masses. The easiest thing to do is to just soften the deck and make it more user friendly to a broader spectrum of the market participants. 

Now, there are always exceptions to the this rule, but this is the general rule of thumb. 

 


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Mig
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21/02/2020 10:45 am  
Posted by: @pow_hnd
Posted by: @elektropow

 

@michi you're right, this year's Fusion feels like a noodle in comparison to the red crimson one hand flexing.. Is this becoming a trend for Nitro? 

I can't say if it becoming a trend for Nitro, but this is what I can tell you from almost 2 decades in the industry and being  tech rep and R&D rider for a major brand. 

Yes, most likely it is becoming a trend for Nitro. 

But it happens with all brands as they grow.

Even ridden a first or second year Capita Black Snowboard of Death? Those things were crazy stiff. Are they that stiff anymore? Nope. Not even close.

Wanna know the reason?

Sales growth.

As a brand and/or board becomes more popular ( with very few exceptions ) a brands boards generally get softer. Why? Because Joe Schmoe, your average weekend warrior who only rides 7.1 days a year according to the National Ski Area Association, wants to go buy that high end board that he/she saw in a video or saw a pro rider riding. The issue is the MFG wants them to have a good time on that deck, so as it ( the deck or brand ) becomes more popular, they soften up the decks so your 7.1 day a year rider will have a good time on it. If it's super stiff, your less skilled riders will more than likely not have a good time with the brand/board and might go else where on their next purchase. 

It why Burtons are all general pretty soft. They want to make sure they keep that top market share. Yes, they have a range of stiffness in their brand relative to their other decks, but they don't make anything truly stiff ( at least in my opinion ) and they won't because they want Joe Schmoe to keep coming back and buying that $600 Custom every other year, or maybe every year. With the exception of one or two decks in the Burton line, your Joe Schmoe can buy any one of Burtons decks and be able to ride it and have a good time. If they make it stiff and the rider that only rides 7.1 days a year struggles with it because it's more board than they can handle, they may lose future sales. 

You have to remember, we here on EL are the small minority. The vast majority of purchase power in the industry comes from weekend warriors, and brands want them, with their lesser skills to have fun on that "high-end" deck they just purchased. 

So, generally, when a boards sales unit numbers move up, the deck softens, or has something else done to make it easier to ride by the masses. The easiest thing to do is to just soften the deck and make it more user friendly to a broader spectrum of the market participants. 

Now, there are always exceptions to the this rule, but this is the general rule of thumb. 

 

I have been repeating this for years and years and years...


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unsatisfiedus
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21/02/2020 11:29 am  
Posted by: @pow_hnd

You have to remember, we here on EL are the small minority. The vast majority of purchase power in the industry comes from weekend warriors, and brands want them...

 

good insight.  

last time i was at my local i stopped to appreciate that boards i'm interested in are even available. i'm surprised any of the manufacturers have as many different decks in their lineups as they do.  seems like it would be a lot easier to offer more top sheet options and fewer shapes and most people wouldn't really notice.  

 


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cortado
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21/02/2020 12:58 pm  
Posted by: @pow_hnd
Posted by: @elektropow

 

@michi you're right, this year's Fusion feels like a noodle in comparison to the red crimson one hand flexing.. Is this becoming a trend for Nitro? 

I can't say if it becoming a trend for Nitro, but this is what I can tell you from almost 2 decades in the industry and being  tech rep and R&D rider for a major brand. 

Yes, most likely it is becoming a trend for Nitro. 

But it happens with all brands as they grow.

Ever ridden a first or second year Capita Black Snowboard of Death? Those things were crazy stiff. Are they that stiff anymore? Nope. Not even close.

Wanna know the reason?

Sales growth.

As a brand and/or board becomes more popular ( with very few exceptions ) a brands boards generally get softer. Why? Because Joe Schmoe, your average weekend warrior who only rides 7.1 days a year according to the National Ski Area Association, wants to go buy that high end board that he/she saw in a video or saw a pro rider riding. The issue is the MFG wants them to have a good time on that deck, so as it ( the deck or brand ) becomes more popular, they soften up the decks so your 7.1 day a year rider will have a good time on it. If it's super stiff, your less skilled riders will more than likely not have a good time with the brand/board and might go else where on their next purchase. 

It why Burtons are all general pretty soft. They want to make sure they keep that top market share. Yes, they have a range of stiffness in their brand relative to their other decks, but they don't make anything truly stiff ( at least in my opinion ) and they won't because they want Joe Schmoe to keep coming back and buying that $600 Custom every other year, or maybe every year. With the exception of one or two decks in the Burton line, your Joe Schmoe can buy any one of Burtons decks and be able to ride it and have a good time. If they make it stiff and the rider that only rides 7.1 days a year struggles with it because it's more board than they can handle, they may lose future sales. 

You have to remember, we here on EL are the small minority. The vast majority of purchase power in the industry comes from weekend warriors, and brands want them, with their lesser skills to have fun on that "high-end" deck they just purchased. 

So, generally, when a boards sales unit numbers move up, the deck softens, or has something else done to make it easier to ride by the masses. The easiest thing to do is to just soften the deck and make it more user friendly to a broader spectrum of the market participants. 

Now, there are always exceptions to the this rule, but this is the general rule of thumb. 

 

This might explain why first year Juice Wagon was pretty stiff, but subsequent years were much, much softer. 


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Spenser
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21/02/2020 4:05 pm  

That explains a change in stiffness over a number of years - actually decades. What we are talking about here is very recent boards where, for some reason, they just make them softer. The squash is a little on the stiffer side by today’s standards, but I definitely don’t consider it a truly stiff board at all. It’s easy to ride. There was no reason to make it any softer and give it a floppy nose 🙄  honestly seems like a mistake, somehow. I would be more surprised to find out it was intentional.


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pow_hnd
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21/02/2020 8:57 pm  
Posted by: @spenser

That explains a change in stiffness over a number of years - actually decades. What we are talking about here is very recent boards where, for some reason, they just make them softer. The squash is a little on the stiffer side by today’s standards, but I definitely don’t consider it a truly stiff board at all. It’s easy to ride. There was no reason to make it any softer and give it a floppy nose 🙄  honestly seems like a mistake, somehow. I would be more surprised to find out it was intentional.

I can text Benny and ask him. 


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Spenser
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21/02/2020 9:15 pm  

I like the OG blankness anyway, just want a stiff 63. Some insight would be cool just for kicks!


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Spenser
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21/02/2020 10:38 pm  

Finally went for it. Shit picture, but this should have been the OG 63! Matte black/gloss Q

777B0D21 CE71 4A4D 9785 DB2147614B38

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